Cervantes
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Post by Cervantes on Feb 6, 2021 13:18:40 GMT
At the time, Timothy Dalton's "License to Kill" was more of the "Dirty Harry" version of Bond. Nothing wrong with that, and I enjoy it more so now. I may be in the minority here, but I remember License to Kill being one of my favourite Bond movies and I thought Dalton completely nailed the role.
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centipede
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Post by centipede on Feb 6, 2021 14:12:30 GMT
Oh, look who's back! Hi Melee!
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Feb 6, 2021 19:08:04 GMT
I'm currently watching all of the Bond movies since I haven't watched them all, and today I watched this movie, and wow do I disagree with the Pub on this one: "GoldeneEye, the Bond movie that was in development hell for a while and made one of the best Bonds quit the franchise. So a new movie, a new Bond actor, how did Pierce Brosnan fare? Well, if the movie was not so awful, maybe it would be easier to judge his performance. GoldenEye is often said to be one of the better Bond movies, but I cannot for the life of me see how anyone can prefer this over a myriad of the other films. There a couple of things I liked in it like the opening sequence. It was cool, but had an over the top implausible ending. The opening credits are perhaps the best in any Bond movie since Goldfinger and the tank chase sequence was pretty fun. Now all the fucking awful moments. The hacking, my fuck, the hacking. It is the 90's alright, so we need hacking to be the star of every god damn plot device. Let us add one of the worst Russian accent hacker boys to the cringe pot and we got ourselves screen disaster. The female henchman is the worst henchman in all of these movies. She gets sexual pleasure from squeezing people to death with her thighs. This is something I could expect from a B-movie, not a Bond movie. Sean Bean is a great actor, but his character fucking sucks man. This guy is supposed to be close to Bond and have had all of these moments together with him, but he has never once been mentioned and he did not seem that close to him in the opening sequence. It was all too obvious too that he would return as a villain, although they never bothered to explain how he survived. Also his plans were only briefly mentioned at the end of film. The Bond girl was also pretty bad, and she only added to the feminist overtones this movie has, which only feels cringeworthy to me. Even the music is subpar as aside from the theme, all we get is this 90's techno nonsense. I actually hate to say it, but I think this is the worst Bond of them all up to this point, even beating out Live and Let Die to the throne of shit. Such a disappointment." 1.5/5 Shit Bond. I am going to disagree a bit. This movie came out after a long hiatus for Bond, from what I remember. At the time, Timothy Dalton's "License to Kill" was more of the "Dirty Harry" version of Bond. Nothing wrong with that, and I enjoy it more so now. But it was a far departure from the Roger Moore version which I grew up with. GoldenEye was a return to that with a mix of the smoothness of the Connery one.
I am going to say this is the "best" of the Brosnan ones simply because it has the best villain of the 4: evil Bill Gates is lame, North Korea was kinda a joke, and guy with bullet slowly going into brain/crazy girlfriend. What makes a good bond movie is a memorable villain. Without that, it can quickly get to "meh."
Sure man, of course you can disagree with me, and I know I'm in the minority when I say GoldenEye is bad, but I don't think it deserves a crucifixion like someone else thinks. GoldenEye might be more of a return to the Moore era in terms of tone, but that's the thing I like the least about the Moore movies. Too much flirting and silliness instead of actual spy thriller elements. I watched Tomorrow Never Dies yesterday and I thought that was a much more entertaining movie and the villains were actually memorable in that movie. The evil media mogul had a plan that made a lot of sense even though his motivations were kind of sketchy, but his German companions were pretty great and so was the car chase sequence.
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Feb 6, 2021 19:10:23 GMT
At the time, Timothy Dalton's "License to Kill" was more of the "Dirty Harry" version of Bond. Nothing wrong with that, and I enjoy it more so now. I may be in the minority here, but I remember License to Kill being one of my favourite Bond movies and I thought Dalton completely nailed the role. Both License to Kill and The Living Daylights are among my favorites. Dalton is up there with Sean Connery for being the best Bond. He nailed the role in those two movies and it's a shame he didn't star in more. He also got the absolute best gun barrel scene. It's like *boom there is fucking Bond man. He nailed it.
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Cervantes
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Post by Cervantes on Feb 6, 2021 23:02:26 GMT
(Dalton) also got the absolute best gun barrel scene. I just rewatched the gunbarrel scenes on Youtube and I agree, it surely is. Sean Connery ends in an awkward position, almost out of balance. Lazenby is surprisingly good due to how fast he goes from casually walking to his shooting position, but his hand throw is a bit clumsy and most people won't like the final kneeling position. I think Moore actually misses his shot in the first of them (the gun goes off before it's properly centered); in the following ones, he takes too long to aim and shoot. Brosnan is very precise and fast, almost as good as Dalton, but I prefer Dalton's final position due to it implying that now Bond is ready for combat, while Brosnan is completely stiff. Craig does a perfect shoot on Casino Royale, but there's no walking; on Quantum of Solace he does the entire scene too fast, almost as if they were in a hurry to film it, I don't like it at all; in Skyfall, the scene is paused too soon, and in Spectre the gun is too low (I think he misses the shot, like Moore). To me, it's Dalton for the very best gunbarrel scene, followed by Brosnan. And with this, we might have entered in the most random film discussion in this pub!
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Feb 7, 2021 1:06:18 GMT
(Dalton) also got the absolute best gun barrel scene. I just rewatched the gunbarrel scenes on Youtube and I agree, it surely is. Sean Connery ends in an awkward position, almost out of balance. Lazenby is surprisingly good due to how fast he goes from casually walking to his shooting position, but his hand throw is a bit clumsy and most people won't like the final kneeling position. I think Moore actually misses his shot in the first of them (the gun goes off before it's properly centered); in the following ones, he takes too long to aim and shoot. Brosnan is very precise and fast, almost as good as Dalton, but I prefer Dalton's final position due to it implying that now Bond is ready for combat, while Brosnan is completely stiff. Craig does a perfect shoot on Casino Royale, but there's no walking; on Quantum of Solace he does the entire scene too fast, almost as if they were in a hurry to film it, I don't like it at all; in Skyfall, the scene is paused too soon, and in Spectre the gun is too low (I think he misses the shot, like Moore). To me, it's Dalton for the very best gunbarrel scene, followed by Brosnan. And with this, we might have entered in the most random film discussion in this pub! I completely agree on everything in your sentiment. Dalton is clearly the best, followed by Brosnan. Both are incredibly smooth and on point. The early ones from Connery and Lazenby with the kneeling are a bit awkward, however Lazenby is smooth in his transition, but Moore is obviously the worst. He's so slow and he is not even shooting the guy. The Bob Simmons one isn't that bad though despite being slow.
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scipioafricanus
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Post by scipioafricanus on Feb 7, 2021 3:14:26 GMT
(Dalton) also got the absolute best gun barrel scene. I just rewatched the gunbarrel scenes on Youtube and I agree, it surely is. Sean Connery ends in an awkward position, almost out of balance. Lazenby is surprisingly good due to how fast he goes from casually walking to his shooting position, but his hand throw is a bit clumsy and most people won't like the final kneeling position. I think Moore actually misses his shot in the first of them (the gun goes off before it's properly centered); in the following ones, he takes too long to aim and shoot. Brosnan is very precise and fast, almost as good as Dalton, but I prefer Dalton's final position due to it implying that now Bond is ready for combat, while Brosnan is completely stiff. Craig does a perfect shoot on Casino Royale, but there's no walking; on Quantum of Solace he does the entire scene too fast, almost as if they were in a hurry to film it, I don't like it at all; in Skyfall, the scene is paused too soon, and in Spectre the gun is too low (I think he misses the shot, like Moore). To me, it's Dalton for the very best gunbarrel scene, followed by Brosnan. And with this, we might have entered in the most random film discussion in this pub! Is there a video with all of them together to compare?
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Cervantes
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Post by Cervantes on Feb 7, 2021 4:01:18 GMT
Balder - Oh man, I forgot the Bob Simmons one! I also think its only problem is being too slow, outside that it was a good introduction to the scene. scipioafricanus - There's this one:
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Dlotn
Strong Wing
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Post by Dlotn on Feb 7, 2021 4:05:30 GMT
I just rewatched the gunbarrel scenes on Youtube and I agree, it surely is. Sean Connery ends in an awkward position, almost out of balance. Lazenby is surprisingly good due to how fast he goes from casually walking to his shooting position, but his hand throw is a bit clumsy and most people won't like the final kneeling position. I think Moore actually misses his shot in the first of them (the gun goes off before it's properly centered); in the following ones, he takes too long to aim and shoot. Brosnan is very precise and fast, almost as good as Dalton, but I prefer Dalton's final position due to it implying that now Bond is ready for combat, while Brosnan is completely stiff. Craig does a perfect shoot on Casino Royale, but there's no walking; on Quantum of Solace he does the entire scene too fast, almost as if they were in a hurry to film it, I don't like it at all; in Skyfall, the scene is paused too soon, and in Spectre the gun is too low (I think he misses the shot, like Moore). To me, it's Dalton for the very best gunbarrel scene, followed by Brosnan. And with this, we might have entered in the most random film discussion in this pub! Is there a video with all of them together to compare? youtu.be/dUmfxL5JBAw?t=35
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scipioafricanus
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Post by scipioafricanus on Feb 7, 2021 13:57:35 GMT
Balder - Oh man, I forgot the Bob Simmons one! I also think its only problem is being too slow, outside that it was a good introduction to the scene. scipioafricanus - There's this one: K, watching them all. They are almost all terrible from a draw to first shot perspective. Basically, they are all inefficient in their movements. Bob Simmons does this little hop before draw, Connery draw is way to slow and throws his arm out, Moore starts with a forearm grab to a tea cup technique, Lazenby actually isn't bad for a movement to kneeling, Brosnan has way to much wasted motion, and Craig is all over the place: first is not bad but his sightline is below his eye so that shot is going to land low, second is better, but down in the third and back to trash/flash in the 4th. Dalton might be the "best" overall. Most are trying for a point shooting technique, but that is not an easy thing to do and is hardly taught anymore.
If you want to see a good draw to first shot, watch this scene from Miami Vice in the 80s from an IPSC Grandmaster Jim Zubiena. Watch how fast and smooth he is, no flash no dash.
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Feb 7, 2021 14:24:49 GMT
Balder - Oh man, I forgot the Bob Simmons one! I also think its only problem is being too slow, outside that it was a good introduction to the scene. scipioafricanus - There's this one: K, watching them all. They are almost all terrible from a draw to first shot perspective. Basically, they are all inefficient in their movements. Bob Simmons does this little hop before draw, Connery draw is way to slow and throws his arm out, Moore starts with a forearm grab to a tea cup technique, Lazenby actually isn't bad for a movement to kneeling, Brosnan has way to much wasted motion, and Craig is all over the place: first is not bad but his sightline is below his eye so that shot is going to land low, second is better, but down in the third and back to trash/flash in the 4th. Dalton might be the "best" overall. Most are trying for a point shooting technique, but that is not an easy thing to do and is hardly taught anymore.
If you want to see a good draw to first shot, watch this scene from Miami Vice in the 80s from an IPSC Grandmaster Jim Zubiena. Watch how fast and smooth he is, no flash no dash.
The Bond movies aren't going for realism though, but I must say that Miami Vice scene was pretty awesome.
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Balder
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Post by Balder on Feb 7, 2021 16:06:11 GMT
An update: GoldenEye is no longer the worst movie in the series because I just watched Die Another Day, and I wanted to fucking kill myself watching that garbage. Here's a list of how I rank the movies of the ones I've rewatched: letterboxd.com/balder/list/james-bond-007-ranked/
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Cervantes
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Post by Cervantes on Feb 7, 2021 20:01:56 GMT
Balder - Yep, no contest there: Die Another Day is terrible and temporarily killed the franchise, being the reason why Casino Royale went for a much more grounded Bond (except for the out of place parkour scenes, which were trending at the time).
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Balder
Supreme Overlord
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Post by Balder on Feb 7, 2021 21:11:38 GMT
Btw the Maestro comment has now been turned into a meme and copy pasta between my friends and I. Here's one example a friend of mine posted on my Mulan (2020) review:
Balder please do the Disney fandom the world a big favor and drop dead, because you are clearly not a Disney fan. Anyone who thinks that Mulan is worse than 80-90's era sacrilege like the Aladdin, which had no CGI, no speaking animals, a totally un-sexy, politically correct princess, and a deranged, Moriarty rip-off of a villain is clearly not in a position to toss out objectives about the newer entries in the series. Balder, you are the millennial cancer killing the Disney franchise. Congrats on your failure. It must suck to be a loser like you.
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Dlotn
Strong Wing
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Post by Dlotn on Feb 7, 2021 23:38:35 GMT
Btw the Maestro comment has now been turned into a meme and copy pasta between my friends and I. Here's one example a friend of mine posted on my Mulan (2020) review: Balder please do the Disney fandom the world a big favor and drop dead, because you are clearly not a Disney fan. Anyone who thinks that Mulan is worse than 80-90's era sacrilege like the Aladdin, which had no CGI, no speaking animals, a totally un-sexy, politically correct princess, and a deranged, Moriarty rip-off of a villain is clearly not in a position to toss out objectives about the newer entries in the series. Balder, you are the millennial cancer killing the Disney franchise. Congrats on your failure. It must suck to be a loser like you. The OG Maestro comment was pretty funny. I read it to a couple of friends i regularly play with and we had a good laugh.
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