Balder
Supreme Overlord
Trying to cut down the amount of movies I watch
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Post by Balder on Apr 7, 2020 12:05:34 GMT
This week: Mega Man Legends series (1 and 2) Year: 2008 Developer: Capcom Publisher: Capcom Platforms: PS1 Chosen by: winnersdontusedrugsNext: All out again
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Post by ModeratorNumber2 on Apr 7, 2020 12:07:59 GMT
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stratogustav
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Post by stratogustav on Apr 7, 2020 18:47:40 GMT
I missed on these because they were RPG, but the characters were a nice addition to the Marvel Vs. Capcom series. Tron Bonne is a very iconic character now.
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scipioafricanus
Cartoon Pony Wrangler
Sega Does What Nintendon't... except the 32X
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Post by scipioafricanus on Apr 7, 2020 21:34:54 GMT
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Pimpjira
Guardian Force Shooter
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Post by Pimpjira on Apr 8, 2020 3:59:27 GMT
I love both games, too bad we never got the third one. I missed on these because they were RPG, but the characters were a nice addition to the Marvel Vs. Capcom series. Tron Bonne is a very iconic character now. They are more action/adventure than they are RPGs so I think people not into RPGs could enjoy them. They also might feel dated to people who never played them before though.
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Cervantes
Off-Brand Transformable Robot
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Post by Cervantes on Apr 8, 2020 5:14:19 GMT
I only played the first one. It was rough around the edges, with design elements that fell behind other 3d games from that era, like Tomb Raider - the movement was more rigid, the camera was more static and didn't have collision detection with the scenery, the levels were even more designed like a grid, most of them were dark corridors and barely had any verticality. That said, it still had really good cell-shaded visuals, maybe the first big game to use them, the story and characters were charming like a 90s anime and some sections and bosses were fun. The mix between action and adventure was good, I had a good time exploring the city and talking to people, while the RPG-like elements were a fun addition, with a simple moral system and the possibility to buy and upgrade weapons and items.
As I see it, the first game showed great potential and proved that Mega Man games could work in a 3d setting if they improved the level design, created more variation (instead of almost the entire game being in dark underground corridors) and worked more on the movement and camera. It's a 3/5 to me.
I only saw the beginning of the second game and immediatelly noticed that the visuals were even better, the story seemed even more elaborate and the game used the dual-analog controller, which is great. If they also improved on the level design and scenery, I easily imagine it being a 5/5 game. Hey, depending on how long this quarantine goes, maybe I could finally get to play it, as I've been looking to play some 90s 3d games (just finished Soul Reaver).
Edit: Here is a good Super Bunnyhop video on the first game. It's very critical of it, but basically points out the elements that I also found a bit lacking and that needed improvement:
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stratogustav
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Post by stratogustav on Apr 9, 2020 0:01:35 GMT
]They are more action/adventure than they are RPGs so I think people not into RPGs could enjoy them. They also might feel dated to people who never played them before though. I didn't know this, I can load them into my PS1 Classic, I was always curious since I am a massive Mega Man fan.
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Post by winnersdontusedrugs on Apr 14, 2020 4:26:31 GMT
Great review Balder! The second Legends game improves a lot on both the controls and graphics. This game takes advantage of dual analog this time, and while it's not exactly up to today's standards, it's still a smooth experience overall and better than almost all of it's contemporaries in the control department. The problem is, the dungeon design overall took a hit. To their credit, each dungeon has a bit more flair than those in the 1st game, with more in the way of landmarks and scripted events. Despite that, the dungeon design itself is near dead simple, to the point where you don't really need a map for the first half of the game. The boss sections are mostly fine. You have a few stinkers like the Glyde fights, which are monotonous and time consuming. The rest of boss lineup is solid though. For a long time I've seen people say that bosses can simply be circle-strafed to death, and while this is true on the easier difficulties, I don't think it applies to the harder ones. When you actually have to analyze bosses and like you would in any other MM game, it's a whole different experience. In fact, Legends 2 might have my favorite final boss fight in the series as a whole. For everything that could've gone wrong in designing such a fight for a 3D game in '99, the result is astoundingly competent. In a lot of ways, it makes sense how this series bit the dust. Everything that defined this series back in the day is both commonplace and usually done to a bigger extent in today's games. That said, I think the fact that a lot today's action/adventure games are such a similar blend of action, exploration, and light RPG elements that MML was shows that Capcom had their finger on the pulse of the gaming industry at the time. It's a shame that such a forward-thinking and endearing series got cut off before it really had a chance to mature.
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stratogustav
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Post by stratogustav on Apr 14, 2020 8:24:46 GMT
Too bad he deleted his review. I didn't get to see it.
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Balder
Supreme Overlord
Trying to cut down the amount of movies I watch
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Post by Balder on Apr 14, 2020 10:43:31 GMT
Too bad he deleted his review. I didn't get to see it. I don't know I wrote a review and deleted it. Must have been great as they usually are. A shame that I didn't get to read my own review either.
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Post by winnersdontusedrugs on Apr 14, 2020 17:30:26 GMT
Lol I meant Cervantes , feel free to kill me anytime guys
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Cervantes
Off-Brand Transformable Robot
A former Incompetent Evil Commander (XP: 2423)
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Post by Cervantes on Apr 15, 2020 7:42:47 GMT
winnersdontusedrugs - It seems winners DID use drugs this time! I've just played a few minutes of Legends 2's tutorial through emulation and yes, I'm impressed at how much it nails the modern 3rd-person controls. In 2000 that was not a common thing, using a dual-analog configuration was still experimental. That combined with the game having weapon upgrades and a mix of action/exploration/RPG makes it feel surprisingly modern.
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Balder
Supreme Overlord
Trying to cut down the amount of movies I watch
Posts: 6,838
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Post by Balder on Apr 15, 2020 10:48:01 GMT
Lol I meant Cervantes , feel free to kill me anytime guys No take-backs dammit.
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Cervantes
Off-Brand Transformable Robot
A former Incompetent Evil Commander (XP: 2423)
Posts: 2,863
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Post by Cervantes on Jun 13, 2020 13:49:04 GMT
I'll copy my Legends 2 review from the other thread:
Mega Man Legends 2 was a real improvement over the original in almost every area. The most important fix were the controls: it supports the PS1 dual shock controller, with it the controls are exactly like any modern third-person shooter. Also, now Mega Man can move while locking on the enemies. Considering how the lock on and dual analog configuration (movement+camera) for shooters only became common by the middle of the PS2 generation, MML2 must be among the first games to implement it right. The graphics are also better than the first game, with more detailed models and scenery (the levels now have ceilings and multiple floors) and more colors, for which they used the PS1 dithering effect - not everyone likes it, but I think it works well here. The animations were touched up, flow more naturally, and there are many more cutscenes, which are all done in-engine and are very well animated. As for the game itself, it now has multiple towns and every dungeon is different from each other, with specific gimmicks, enemies and visuals - in MML1 this was a huge flaw, with every dungeon looking like the same. To sum it up, MML2 is a more polished game that feels modern, and the lessons learned both by the first one and by the impact of Ocarina of Time are very perceptible here. Even the enemies' attack patterns were changed so you can't defeat all of them just by running in circles.
It's not perfect, though, and a few aspects are downgrades from the first game. For example, with more detailed visuals the areas became much smaller, so there are no large, sprawling areas like the city or the fields from MML1: they are all divided into smaller sections and there are just too many loading times between one area and the other, so navigation becomes a bit annoying with time. While there are more towns, they don't have as much to do as in the first game: there are almost no side quests or minigames, and the characters don't change their dialogues as you progress, so it doesn't feel as dynamic as MML1. Also, there are two dungeons in the game that are underwater, and they feel almost broken: their only gimmick is that everything moves in slow motion, so it takes forever to go through them, it's grating and one of the most stupid decisions I've seen in a game (the game moves at around 1/3 of its normal speed, it's quite terrible). Another change is that the dungeons aren't connected like in the first game, so there's no more of that Metroid feeling - you just complete each of them once and there's no need to come back for further exploration, it's like Zelda.
Because of all that, I think MML2 is the better game overall, but, provided you can deal with its archaic controls, MML1 is more replayable and memorable, with more things to discover on repeated plays and more interesting characters and dialogues.
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