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Post by spidershinobi on Sept 9, 2016 13:58:45 GMT
Yesterday I was on the sofa, doing nothing, bored, so I thought "why not watch that stream of the Sony conference the SBF said they'd do?", and that's what I did. ... Holy crap! That thing was botched so hard! Not only do they announce a system with the worst name ever - Ps4 PRO?! Really?! - they announce it alongside the already surpassed Ps4 Slim. To make it worse they showcase a total of what seemed to be only 2 actual videogames. And to agree with the streamers the lack of Griffith gameplay, maybe just a little sneak peek at the Zodd boss fight, or even a comparison between the Eclipse on Ps4 and Ps4 pro, any of those could have salvaged the show.
Now, I know that when it comes to Ps4 nothing is a botch, everything is perfect, and everyone will buy all the units as soon as they're released, but had any other company presented THAT I doubt there wouldn't be memes plaguing the internet right now. I got the feeling that any new announcement from Microsoft or Nintendo, or even a regular Steam sale would stomp all over Sony's thing. Wonder if anyone even realized how cringey it was.
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stratogustav
Supreme Overlord
Warrior with Bandana
Posts: 7,646
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Post by stratogustav on Sept 9, 2016 14:52:29 GMT
What's funny is that this does not benefit anyone with a decent 4K TV. I watched the samples they put up on my 4K TV, and the upscaling the Pro does is exactly the same a Triluminous 4K Bravia TV already does to current PS4 games.
It looks like those games won't be native 4K at all, they are just upscaled. They talk about 90%, even that quote is funny. Just try it with a F1 game, there is no difference.
If you play let's say Street Fighter V on a 1080p and then on a 4K TV, you see the difference, that's the difference they are talking about, I tried that and yes there is a difference, so if your TV does not come with a 4K upscaler sure it will make it look better, but on a 4K TV with a built in upscaler as most 4K TVs already come with, the upscaling the 4K TV does is exactly the same from what they have shown.
They talk about Netflix and YouTube in 4K. I haven't even see a TV that doesn't do that already. Most 4K TVs are Smart TVs and have a tone of 4K apps built in. Mine does, I'm sure that's also the case for most people.
I am a super fan of Sony stuff, but give me a break, this is a total joke. Even if there is a small difference, no one with a built in upscaler is going to notice it.
The only benefit I can see for doubling the power is a higher frame rate on VR games, but if they can't even confidently deliver at least 60 FPS on all non-VR titles, and they still say it depends on the game, how can one expect them to deliver the necessary 90 FPS for VR titles? One just can't.
I heard rumors that even with the announced specs for the Scorpio you can't deliver the majority of games on native 4K. That along shows how far behind these rigs are from what they promise. Ultimately it is just marketing.
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Cervantes
Off-Brand Transformable Robot
A former Incompetent Evil Commander (XP: 2423)
Posts: 2,863
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Post by Cervantes on Sept 9, 2016 15:33:18 GMT
Yep, not even top-of-the-line pcs with really good/expensive GPUs will run modern games in 4k, so I doubt a console that is built to be cheaper than a pc will do it. I think the difference between the normal consoles and their upgraded versions will be more or less like the difference between the 3DS and the New 3DS - it's an improvement and some games will take advantage of it, but if people are expecting to play games natively in such a high resolution there will be a lot of disappointment. Some games may support it (games with simple, stylized graphics - think of something like Rez), but most of them will just be upscaled.
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Cervantes
Off-Brand Transformable Robot
A former Incompetent Evil Commander (XP: 2423)
Posts: 2,863
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Post by Cervantes on Sept 9, 2016 15:47:12 GMT
For reference, here's a blog post (from yesterday) in which The Witness' developer talks about his patch for the PS4 Pro: See, this is a game with very simple (although stylized) graphics, so it doesn't demand too much from the GPU, and yet it's aiming for just a 1440p resolution, also known as "not even close to 4k". The post specifically says that they may achieve a higher resolution if they do some trade-offs, like lowering the quality of reflections and other things. Also, it's limited to 60fps, while nowadays most pc games will go higher than that if your screen allows it (with 120fps being currently the usual limit). So, I think 1080p/1440p @60fps will probably be most common case, depending on the game. That's a much more realistic expectation. Keep in mind most standard PS4 games don't even run at 1080p/60fps ( The Witness itself runs at 900p, according to its developer), so it's indeed an improvement - but not a huge jump, especially compared to what gaming pcs, even the cheaper ones, already do easily.
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Post by spidershinobi on Sept 9, 2016 16:04:11 GMT
Some interesting details you guys bring, because I don't know anyone who owns a 4k TV, and I never searched about the subject, so I wouldn't know those details. But yeah, I don't think there's any 4k that won't be Youtube compatible and regularly display 4k videos. The only benefit I can see for doubling the power is a higher frame rate on VR games, but if they can't even confidently deliver at least 60 FPS on all non-VR titles, and they still say it depends on the game, how can one expect them to deliver the necessary 90 FPS for VR titles? One just can't.I love that you said that because in the end we still aren't guaranteed to get great performances and graphics anyway! That presentation even feels kind of scammy now that you guys brought those points. With that mind I think the highlights of the presentation were the comparison and reveal moments, just for how mockable that event managed to get.
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Post by spidershinobi on Sept 9, 2016 16:07:14 GMT
The post specifically says that they may achieve a higher resolution if they do some trade-offs, like lowering the quality of reflections and other things. Also, it's limited to 60fps, while nowadays most pc games will go higher than that if your screen allows it (with 120fps being currently the usual limit). Just wait till developers begin downporting Ps4 games to Ps4 pro.
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Post by manicottimafia on Sept 9, 2016 18:25:39 GMT
Sony is dumb. They were doing great and all of a sudden it's like they're allergic to money. I want to want a ps4 so bad, but come on.
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fsfsxii
Space Striker
What to believe...
Posts: 916
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Post by fsfsxii on Sept 9, 2016 18:33:07 GMT
The conference itself was very underwhelming. Specifications wise, the PS4 Pro is really great. 4k capable at 400$, thats a steal to some. Even better, devs don't have to put in extra work for 4k textures, that is huge. I'd buy it for FFXV and to keep my siblings out of my room if they want to play something. Here are some comparison shots between PS4 Pro version of ROTTR and PC version.
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leaon79s
Ace Bomber
Dishonorable Miscreant
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Post by leaon79s on Sept 9, 2016 19:36:02 GMT
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Dan E. Kool
Walking Trash Can Robot
Now With Extra Pulp!
Posts: 3,325
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Post by Dan E. Kool on Sept 9, 2016 22:18:39 GMT
I'm surprised by: how dumb Sony is and how much people care.
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billspreston
Cheru Wing
I wrote Max Reebo's first 3 hits
Posts: 336
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Post by billspreston on Sept 9, 2016 22:34:10 GMT
I don't get it. It's like a nice smell. After 5 minutes your brain stops telling you how nice the smell is. You become acclimatized to things.
Probably good for PC games where you're at a desk playing with a keyboard and mouse but apart from that - meh.
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lukefonfabre388
Air Dueler
Move like a shadow, sting like a nuke.
Posts: 550
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Post by lukefonfabre388 on Sept 9, 2016 23:05:02 GMT
Glad I switched to PC when I did. Consoles have really gone downhill over the years. PC is beginning to do everything better then consoles ever have and the only reason people buy consoles anymore is because of ease of use and exclusives.
I'll admit PC aint perfect either but all the advantages you have over consoles with it are to numerous to list.
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fsfsxii
Space Striker
What to believe...
Posts: 916
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Post by fsfsxii on Sept 9, 2016 23:28:49 GMT
I don't get it. It's like a nice smell. After 5 minutes your brain stops telling you how nice the smell is. You become acclimatized to things. Probably good for PC games where you're at a desk playing with a keyboard and mouse but apart from that - meh. oh my, we need more controversial news to bring back old members to the pub. Welcome back
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Post by winnersdontusedrugs on Sept 10, 2016 3:40:44 GMT
Who the hell cares about 4K, who even notices a difference past 1440p without squinting? I'm still waiting for the majority of game devs to make post-processing effects that don't blur the screen. Also, if the image is getting upscaled to 4K that might mean more input lag. If you're using a 4KTV and a wireless controller the levels of input lag could possibly get out of hand.
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stratogustav
Supreme Overlord
Warrior with Bandana
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Post by stratogustav on Sept 10, 2016 4:47:50 GMT
I had been looking for a CPU with Windows 10 installed that can natively send a 4K signal to my TV and I can't find anything. Either I'm looking at the wrong places or they just don't make them. Everything they sell is half built, missing HDD, missing OS, missing RAM, it is always missing something, or it is just not powerful enough to send a native UHD signal. Nothing is good right now. It is almost like they want you to build your own thing and just try to figure out. Nothing is consumer friendly anymore, that's not a good sign.
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